Jan 23: The Táin

Consider this first reading from The Táin—bearing in mind that the first 8 tales are actually separate ones known as the remscéla, not directly part of the extended story of The Táin but connected to it. Considering all of these different narratives, what struck you about the ways one or more women are represented? You might focus narrowly on one woman, or offer a generalization that is appropriate to more than one woman.

15 thoughts on “Jan 23: The Táin

  1. I thought it was a bit bizarre that most if not near all of the women in the opening stories before the Tain are pregnant. It seems to reinforce this idea that they are seen as bearers of children and valued for their ability to produce heirs. I also thought the three year and three months pregnancy sounded miserable, but that’s a bit off topic.

    Another general observation I had was that the women are sort of tossed from man to man as sexual partners, which was disturbing. More disturbing yet was the idea that newly-wedded women would sleep first with the king before their husband. I thought this was, aside from horrifying, a way in which women were not conceptualized as people in the same facet as men.

  2. I thought that Aife was a noteworthy female character for her description as “the hardest woman warrior in the world” (p. 32). Her traditionally masculine role combined with her power over Cúchulainn (as she destroys his weapon) demonstrate a powerful woman unlike we’ve seen previously. In this sense, the woman is powerful in a stereotypically non-female way. However, the undertones of traditional femininity ultimately act as her downfall, one example of which appears as Cúchulainn “seized her by the two breasts” demonstrating the prominence of her gender and her sexuality in the battle. This idea of female sexuality being associated with defeat extends itself as she is ordered to bear Cúchulainn a son and eventually gives her body over to him. As a result, even the women who are described as the most powerful in stories like these remain controlled by societal norms associated with gender.

  3. In general, the majority of the women that have been discussed in the text thus far have all been represented very similarly. They have all been portrayed as being expendale to men, and seen solely as vessels to create children, specifically boys. They are not seen as women, they are solely seen as sexual objects for men to take advantage of. There are two really great examples of this in the text. The first is on page 23, where there is a clear instance of sexual assault, although that is not the proper term to use, this website will not allow me to use the correct term, that is done to a woman. She is simply drinking from a cup of liquid, and suddenly she feels a “tiny creature” slip into her mouth and she swallows it hole with the liquid. When she wakes up in the morning, she discovers that the man who put the creature in her drink has planted a child in who womb which she was then forced to bore (23). The second example is when Cùchulainn is battling Aife. Aife is winning this battle, and then out of nowhere, Cùchulainn takes her horses and kills them, knowing that they are what is most precious to her. When Aife has discovered this, she is at her weakest, and Cùchulainn takes advantage of this and pins her down. When he is about to kill her, he gives her three requirements, and if she fulfills all of these requirements he will let her live. One of these desires is for her to sleep with him, and give him a child. She is then forced to have sex with him in order for her life to be spared. The women in this story are continuously objectified, and repeatedly abused by the men in the story and the societal norms of the time.

  4. The prophetess Fedelm is the female character that strikes me in the most powerful way. Her description makes her seem very small and meek- however she holds skills that others cannot possess. When being described, attention is drawn to her lips, teeth, hair, eyelashes, and many more physical features. Other attributes outside of her physical appearance are never discussed, and her title is only mentioned because she brings it up. This woman is capable of seeing things that other people are not, but her credibility is automatically questioned by her male counterparts in the story. Her statements are automatically questioned because it is not the answer that Medb is hoping to obtain.

    • Upon rereading the story, and realizing Medb is also a woman, I think it brings up the question of female to female culture. Its an unsupportive system in which women are oppressing other women.

  5. As mentioned above, it’s interesting to see how, in the tales leading up to the Tain, the women are usually pregnant and their characterization revolves around reproduction or sex in some way. This is an interesting foil to Queen Medb in the actual story. Right from the beginning she emphasizes how she was “well enough” without her husband, the king (52). From the parts we read we see her discuss her understanding of combat and how she has sway and power over troops (53, 66). In stories that involve a Queen, her typical role is to provide an heir for the King and given the theme of the stories before I expected to see a similar expectation put on the Queen that has yet to be seen. In the parts we have read of the Tain, Medb can be characterized as almost an equal to her husband both politically and on the ground as a commander. Troops are referred to as “her troops” and she emphasizes that her fortune is hers when she compares her worth to her husbands.

  6. I think it is a very interesting contrast in the first eight stories with how most of the women are pregnant, serving traditional gender roles, but two rather prominent and strong characters, Scathach and Aife, are women. Both are warriors and renowned ones at that. Cuchulainn goes to Scathach to study “the warrior’s art with her” so he can beat any hero in Europe (28). Aife is the chief of her own territory and is regarded as the “hardest woman warrior in the world” (32). I didn’t expect these powerful roles to be filled by women in literature of that time, especially after the majority of the previous female characters were just acting as wives and mothers. This can, I think, show modern-day readers that women had a typical place, but it was also possible for women to be in positions of power, if in no other way than in a literary realm.

  7. After this initial reading of the book, what struck me most was how in the introduction and first parts of the book, very few women were given names. The women of the knights and other men in the story were referred to simply as “woman” and not given much importance even though they were the ones who cared for their husbands and had their children. They are treated like objects and aren’t given a second thought when one of their husbands decides they want to do something. In the story about the woman who races the chariot, her husband disregards the fact that she is heavily pregnant with twins and forces her to race anyway. Women’s thoughts and feelings are always second to what men want and they are so unimportant to society at this time that they aren’t even given names, which dehumanizes them and further perpetuates the idea that they are ‘objects’

  8. The representation of women within the readings of The Táin were particularly jarring, especially after comparing it to the readings by Marie de France. The story that stuck out to me most was Cuchulainn’s Courtship of Emer, where he had to defeat many people before even being able to “court” Emer. Cuchulainn was made to face Aife, a woman warrior quoted to be, “the hardest woman warrior in the world” (32). This was shocking to me, making me reconsider how women were viewed during this time, but my shock was quickly reduced when Cuchulainn, quite simply, defeats this renowned warrior. Instead of challenging her to a proper battle, he tricks her by getting her to look another way then, “seized her by the two breasts” (33). Through a feminist perspectic, this deminishes her as an equal foe, making her seem as a joke by grabbing her by the breasts then throwing her over his should “like a sack” (33). Instead of fighting back, which she had the time to do while being grabbed and carried away, she takes the defeat, which is very unrealistic. Despite Aife being such a strong warrior, she accepts defeat so easily, allowing her people to be taken, killed, and her body to be used. It appears that women are not considered to be anywhere near on the same level as men; their strength and power is diminished while the men only focus on their bodies and their abilities to produce children. Even then, children are barely considered or cared for as much when women can just produce more. How they are represented in all the stories is that though they may be powerful, they’re only as powerful as a woman can be; they will never be as powerful as a man, in any sense.

  9. The Tain definitely seemed to imply that women’s lives were restricted to servicing men, and that they should be happy with that. The woman who becomes Crunniuc’s wife serves him as soon as she meets him, somehow knowing how everything needs to be in the house and working without being asked. There is a sort of flashforward to their day at the fair, where she is pregnant. Although she advises him not to boast, he still does. Because of this, she is expected to race a horse drawn chariot while going into labor. This is essentially a woman being expected to go through extreme physical pain for her husband, who has gotten himself into trouble by not heeding her advice. This reminds me of something I heard in a previous WGST class, which is that women are expected to suffer as a martyr to show their faithfulness.

  10. I was also shocked to find that most, if not all, of the women before the Tain was pregnant. Women were seen as sexual objects to be taken advantage of by man to man and child-bearers to produce heirs. It was painful to read that the pregnancy lasted three years and three months. I was disturbed by the fact that women’s worth was solely based and valued on their ability to reproduce and that they had to sleep with the king first before their husband. I think women were treated poorly, not equally, and were mainly the convenience of a man’s needs instead of being treated like a human being. Although women may seem like they have the power within the stories, they still face gender norms and stereotypes.

  11. Upon reading, one theme that sticks out to me is the association of femininity with the supernatural. Within “The Pangs of Ulster,” Macha becomes impregnated by Crunniuc. When people do not comply with keeping her husband barred, she seemingly curses everyone who hears her “scream” from her “pangs” will “suffer from the same pangs for five days and four nights” (7). She states that a “long-lasting evil will come out of this” (7). Macha embodies the often associated themes of femininity being mystical or magical.
    Much later in the story, another woman named Fedelm appears and notes her visions of the future; however, Medb has a hard time believing her accuracy. Is this partly due to her being a woman?

  12. Generally I felt as if the women throughout the tales were objects for the men and pliable to the whims and commands of these men throughout the pages we read. From their need to be pregnant to being thrown from man to man for sexual pleasures (i.e. the woman needing to sleep with the king first before anyone else) it portrays them as this tool for the men’s own devices. This objectifying is further emphasized through Cuchulainn’s description of Emer on page 27 as he “caught sight of the girl’s breasts over the top of her dress […] ‘I could rest my weapon there.” There are countless examples of this subjugation towards women, but it is interesting to consider Medb’s role throughout The Tain as she is one of the leaders of an army and respected, a striking contrast to the portrayal of women previously.

  13. I felt as though almost all of the women in The Tain were used as vessels for sex and pregnancy and not much else, with the exception of the one eyed hag and Medb. Similar to other medieval works, the women are used to be the objects of a powerful man’s very dramatic love and often included for the purpose of having a son. While Medb seems to be fierce and have strong war tactics, in the beginning she is still made to use her body to offer her “thighs” as a way of attracting Daire. Despite this, she is definitely the woman with the most agency. The others, similar to the women in the lais that we read, were used as objects of love (whether that was voluntary or involuntary) as opposed to well developed characters.

  14. In regards to the tales as a whole, I believe women were not treated fairly at all. Women were just a chess piece for men during this time period and the women weren’t able to change anything about this. When I was reading The Tain, it was nice to read about Medb’s strong actions that went against the stereotypical woman during this time period. She was well-respected as a leader of an army and she made sure her voice was heard.

Leave a Reply

Your email address will not be published. Required fields are marked *